Latane Conant
Latane Conant
No Forms. No Spam. No Cold Calls. The Next Generation of ABM
Latane shines a light on missed customer-acquisition opportunities and discusses the strategies to "light up" the people and companies who are ready to buy using ABM.
The 6sense Account Engagement Platform helps B2B organizations achieve predictable revenue growth by putting the power of AI, big data, and machine learning behind every member of the revenue team. 6sense uncovers anonymous buying behavior, prioritizes accounts for sales and marketing, and enables them to engage resistant buying teams with personalized, multi-channel, multi-touch campaigns.
High Tech

Guest Bio

 Latane Conant, CMO of 6Sense and author of No Forms. No Spam. No Cold Calls., is passionate about empowering marketing leaders with effective technology, predictive insights, and thought leadership. As a self-proclaimed recovering software saleswoman, Latane’s keenly focused on leveraging data to ensure marketing programs result in deals—not just leads. Prior to 6sense, she was CMO and a sales leader at Appirio.

Episode Summary

Latane Conant, CMO of 6Sense and author of No Forms. No Spam. No Cold Calls., discusses the importance of personalized marketing. On this episode of Demand Gen Visionaries, Latane explains her techniques to optimize sales by shining a light on what she calls “the dark funnel”, how her team uses marketing and sales data to generate unified revenue opportunities, and the importance of taking high-risk high-reward chances when unique marketing opportunities present themselves.Latane Conant, CMO of 6Sense and author of No Forms. No Spam. No Cold Calls., discusses the importance of personalized marketing. On this episode of Demand Gen Visionaries, Latane explains her techniques to optimize sales by shining a light on what she calls “the dark funnel”, how her team uses marketing and sales data to generate unified revenue opportunities, and the importance of taking high-risk high-reward chances when unique marketing opportunities present themselves.

Key Takeaways

  • The best demand gen will make people feel something. You need to create a genuine connection with your customer to accelerate their desired results
  • Contacting a potential customer should be personalized and scaled. Cold emails aren’t going to work anymore. You need to stand out.
  • Shine light on prospective clients that might be hiding in “the dark funnel”. Dive deeper into client relations to turn prospects into valued customers.
  • Shift your mindset from demand gen to demand capture. Make the experience unique so you organically retain customers. 
  • Over time, you earn the right to take risks and trust your instinct. Sometimes you have to trust your gut and dismiss outside influences.


“I think the best demand gen makes people feel something. It creates a connection.”
“I'm just going to blow this thing up and prove that if we put prospects and their experiences first, we can generate a f***load of pipeline and succeed, and do it in this new and different way.”
“We decided early on not to have sales ops and marketing ops, but to have revenue ops. As a revenue team, let's always be finding our ‘red’ and always be bringing issues and conversion points forward that aren't performing because that gives us a chance to go and fix them.”
“I just always encourage people. If your gut is telling you that it's the right thing to do, it probably is, and sometimes you gotta take those risks.”
“I would challenge the new-world order to be thinking, not about demand generation, but demand capture. Because if you uncovered ‘the dark funnel’, then you actually see the demand right in front of you.”

Episode Highlights

1:30 Latane's First Job in Demand Gen

  • Latane’s first job in demand gen was as a front-line salesperson who was responsible for finding her own pipeline
  • She’s a pro at creating cool, interesting experiences, and bringing people together
  • She ran around the country doing field marketing events and owned that at Appirio
  • From there she started an inside sales team and eventually became the CMO at Appirio
  • Her motto: Look around and see things that need to be done and just start doing them!

3:30 Her Overall Demand Gen Strategy

  • Brand should not be separated from demand, because the best demand gen campaigns make people feel something and create a connection
  • The magic happens when people feel something and we create a connection
  • The last year, what I’ve been able to do, is break some of the traditional tactics and re-imagine them from an experience first perspective
  • For example, if you’re going to make a purchase decision, you don’t go to your boss without first doing some research
  • The first thing we do in classic demand gen is put up a form that presents that research from happening
  • People reject forms, so some people try to spam email lists, and then what happens as a seller is that we collect mickeymouse@aol.com emails or they’re coming in hot inbound and then your sales team is probably too late.
  • I don’t think that’s a great experience for the buyers or for us in sales & marketing
  • About a year ago, I was here at 6sense but I was feeling overwhelmed, so I took a step back and thought about everything from the perspective of buyer experience
  • Let’s prove that if we put prospects and their experience first, we can generate a ton of pipeline
  • We started this experience last July, we documented everything we did, and that’s what you can now see in the new book “No Forms. No Spam. No Cold Calls: The Next Generation of Account-Based Sales and Marketing
  • And all the money goes to charity!

9:00 Let’s Learn More About 6sense

  • 6sense is an Account Engagement Platform that solves really 3 big challenges 
  • (1) Most buying behavior is anonymous, so we help them uncover that anonymous research and what people and companies are doing the research
  • (2) I want to deliver an amazing experience, but I also want to go to sales club.  So we pick up all of this signal and help sales teams prioritize.  So we show them which accounts are early stage and which accounts are late stage in their buying process.  We show them predictive models that show them who is in market for their solutions
  • (3) Because marketing is very diverse, we should them how their buyers are best able to be reached.  So as a marketer we help people orchestrate how to communicate with them to make sure that organizations are being effective

12:00 How Do You Structure Your Demand Gen Team?

  • I started a year ago with just myself and a Customer Marketing Leader
  • We combined our sales and marketing ops teams and they’re now called “Revenue Ops”
  • We all have access to all of the data and are working off the same plan
  • Digital Marketing we have placed under brand and we think of this as digital experience
  • We’re using things like chat, content hubs, calculator tools
  • We have a growth marketing role, led by a gentleman who started as a BDR and is now focused on demand capture
  • It’s not really about generating demand anymore, it’s about capturing the demand with the best experiences, the coolest field events, the best direct mailers, the best outreach
  • We truly sell to a buying team, and our platform services 4 main personas (a) a head of demand gen (b) the head of SDRs or BDRs, and (c) digital marketing and (d) sales, it’s so important to know when sales should engage

17:30 The Demand Gen Playbook - Uncuttable Budget Items

  • The first thing that is uncuttable is something we call the “Value Card”
  • It’s not that we’re not sending email or calling buyers, but our emails and calls are all geared to add value and known accounts that are in market
  • When an account is in market, a BDR gets notified, and then marketing outlines based on search keywords, what that means for our key personas
  • For example, predictive analytics is one of our top keywords, so we create a Value Card for these keywords and we formulate a value prop for our target audience based on those words.  They are key to ensuring we are adding value to the persona we’re communicating to
  • The second part of our playbook is called the 6QA.  We don’t track any MQLs!
  • We think the account has come from learning, and is ready to engage
  • We have a model that is constantly updating and looking for accounts that meet our ICP criteria, and matching those accounts that we have won.  The model makes sure that we have the right personas.  It measures the level of engagement, and has a timing component that tells us where they are in their buying journey.
  • The third aspect of our playbook is how we connect channels to our dynamic segment and make sure we’re delivering an incredibly personalized experience

22:30 The Content Tactics that are “Crushing It”

  • Direct Mail is crushing it for us. 
  • We use both Alyce and Sendoso for direct mail, both are great
  • I’ve always had a video-first strategy for content. From video you can create social posts, blogs, short pieces.  We’re video-first.
  • The other thing about video and podcasting is that people who are great writers have “writer’s block”, so you can capture some great content that can turn into other pieces like blogs, social posts, and more!

26:00 My Favorite Campaigns

  • We’ve had an interesting program recently.  We were on a CMO roadshow on the state of predictable revenue growth, and the COVID hit…
  • So we scrambled around doing a virtual breakfast series and started talking about what we’re all going to do in times like these.
  • We scrapped the content and started talking about relevant topics and established a weekly call with CMOs talking about how we are operating
  • We now have 500 CMOs that participate in the virtual breakfast series
  • We put all of the content in a content hub, and CMOs can all share
  • I think over time as a CMO you earn the right to take risks, and the biggest thing that I’ve learned, is when my gut was saying something but I wasn’t confident enough
  • If you gut is telling you something is the right thing to do, it probably is

30:45 How Important is Your Website?

  • It’s pretty freakin’ important!
  • Not necessarily your homepage, which is the face of the company
  • But it’s the entire digital “spider web”

32:00 Latane’s Famous Dust-Up

  • I had a huge dust-up with Snoop Dogg!
  • At my former employer Appirio, we were known for the best party at Dreamforce (Salesforce’s annual customer conference)
  • So we wanted to do something different, something more gritty
  • So we booked a “special guest” which was supposed to be Snoop Dogg 
  • The day of the event, Snoop bailed on us, and it was so stressful
  • We ran around and took out $30k in cash and we hired E40 and Too $hort
  • We secured new talent and we had a rager

34:15 Approaching Relationships with Sales

  • One of the things I talk about in the book is being a recovering sales person
  • One of the things we were taught in sales is “looking for red flags” or all of the things that could go wrong in a sales cycle
  • I think about that with respect to revenue ops because we are one revenue team
  • Let’s all look at things that aren’t performing
  • We also use a planning tool called the V2MOM, which gives everyone in the company transparency into what we’re focused on.

36:00 Quick Hits, Getting to Know Latane

  • New hobby during shelter in place...wake surfing!
  • It’s  not as hard as many other water sports because you don’t go as fast
  • I’ve found a new comedian who used to work at Google, Sarah Cooper, who writes “How to be Successful Without Hurting Men’s Feelings: And Other Non-Threatening Leadership Strategies for Women.” Super funny, that's what I've been reading
  • Favorite quote: “Anything worth doing is worth overdoing”
  • Title of your next book: “The CMO Files…”  We’ll see!

Episode Transcript

 Ian Faison: [00:00:00] Welcome to demand gen visionaries. I mean, phase on host of demand, gen visionaries and CEO of Caspian studios. And today I am joined by the amazing Latney. How are you today?

Latane Conant: [00:00:14] And I can't believe that I am a demand gen visionary.

Ian Faison: [00:00:19] You are.

Latane Conant: [00:00:20] This feels like a dream come true. Like I should pinch myself.

Ian Faison: [00:00:25] If no one else is a visionary in demand gen, you are in recent author with your book out right now. No forms, no spam, no cold calls. The next generation of account based sales and marketing it's out. Now everybody can check it out. This is going to be a great interview. I'm super excited. Let's get into it.

What was your first job in demand gen?

Latane Conant: [00:00:48] So my first job in demand gen was being a frontline salesperson, right. And happened to. Gen up a lot of pipeline. That was [00:01:00] probably my, my first job in demand. Yeah. Gave me a lot of experience doing it. And then I've always loved a great party. Ian. In fact, my mother-in-law is convinced that I'm just an overpaid party planner, but I'm good at I'm really good at creating cool, interesting experiences and bringing people together.

I think that's. One of my superpowers at work and also just in my personal life. So I started basically, basically going around the country, running all my own field event, which kind of ticked the current marketing team off. And so then we decided to actually break out and have a field marketing team.

And I took that and ran that for us at Appirio. And then I started an inside sales team. Cause that kind of goes hand in hand and then. Lo and behold, at some point I became the CMO there. So the best thing to do is to look around and see [00:02:00] things that need to get done and just start doing them.

Ian Faison: [00:02:03] An overpaid party planner is better than an underpaid party goer, I suppose, which is I think more of more of my speed in the matter. Okay, so let's get into our first segment. This is the trust tree. This is where you can feel honored and trusted and share your deepest, darkest demand, gen secrets. If you were to say, what is your overall demand gen strategy?

How would you, how would you classify that?

Latane Conant: [00:02:33] So I cannot separate brand from demand. And the reason I say that is because I think. The best demand gen, make people feel something, they create a connection. Right. And I started off talking about being, I love creating experiences and getting the right people too together. And that's kinda when the magic happens.

And so [00:03:00] demand gen is really about figuring out how to do that. At scale and what I've been able to do, which has been so freaking cool the last year is kind of break some of the traditional tactics or things that we think about in demand gen and reimagine them from an experience first perspective. So what do I mean by that?

What I mean is if you look at. How you go to buy Ian in your personal life, but also at work, if you're going to go and make a purchase decision, you're not going to go to your boss without doing a fair amount of research. You're going to ask a bunch of people on your team. They're going to want to do research on making this purchase decision.

And the first thing that we do in sort of the classic traditional demand gen is we put up a form. And prevent that research from happening, which I think is kind of ridiculous. And the whole idea behind the form is to [00:04:00] get an email, to send a bunch of emails. And I don't know about you, but I'm looking, I have 32,749 unread emails right now.

Clearly I have a, an organizational problem and I'm probably somewhat of an outlier with that many, but. I mean, people create whole email accounts just because they don't want to deal with all the emails they get, right. From filling out forms. So we spam people, which is, I think not a great strategy. And then what ends up happening as a seller in B2B is you have these quote unquote leads that are really just someone who.

Either one of the ebook and so gave you the Mickey mouse at AOL email, or is coming in hot, which means they're probably inbounding with five or six other people. And so you're too late. So sales is stuck kind of in a bad situation, making cold calls for the most part to create [00:05:00] good pipeline. And I don't think that's a great experience for anybody.

It's not great for the prospect and the buying team. And it's not really that fun for us in sales and marketing roles. So coming from that perspective, about a year ago, I was here at 6 cents, which is this super cool AI based platform. But feeling kind of like a colossal F up because the technology was really advanced and you know, all these demand genders are doing all these things and I'm like, what am I doing here?

And so I took the step back and I said, well, what, you know, I'm crying and I'm talking to my husband and he's like, you got to play to your stuff. Thanks. And I'm like, I don't know. And I said, wait a second. I know customer experience. That's what we did at Appirio. I understand employee experience and how to do this.

And I happened to have it access to this technology that can tell me so many rich, so [00:06:00] much rich insights about prospects and what they're doing. I'm just going to blow this thing up and prove that if we put prospects and their experience, first, we can generate. An F load of pipeline and succeed and do within this new and different way.

And so we started that experiment last July and have basically we spent about nine months proving it out, and then we documented everything that we did and how we did it. And that's what materialized in the book that you just mentioned that just launched.

Ian Faison: [00:06:32] Which by the way I bought as we were, uh, starting the episode 99 cents, I don't know when the price is going up, but unbelievable. Delivered to my Kindle cloud reader. What a deal.

Latane Conant: [00:06:44] We try, we try all the money, goes to charity. So that's kind of cool. We've got this thing called good sense where we give to various causes. So. I'm just pumped to get it out there. You know, it's so funny. I have the BDR team, or some people call them SDR team [00:07:00] and they're so awesome. They're so energetic and just amazing people to work with.

And, you know, I've had that function under me before at a past company. And usually what you get is restraining orders and complaints. And. All kinds of nonsense about people saying that they're annoying, um, and stop calling me and blah, blah, blah LA, well, this team, and with this approach, every quarter, we get emails to our CEO calling out our BDRs and their outreach and how timely it was, how personalized it was.

So, you know, we're doing something right. I think with how we're orchestrating this.

Ian Faison: [00:07:44] Wait for those of our listeners who don't know, can you share a little bit about 6 cents?

Latane Conant: [00:07:49] Sure. So we are an account engagement platform. What does that mean? Well, what that means is we solve kind of three. Big challenges, really [00:08:00] four big challenges. One most buying behavior is anonymous. So depending on whose research you read it's anywhere from 50 to 70% of the sales cycle is done anonymously.

Um, And as a seller and a marketer, that's incredibly frustrating. Even if we are still using forms, people are, aren't filling them out. So what we help people do is really understand that anonymous research. We call it uncover your dark funnel. So we talked about the fact that you've got all this stuff, animus research.

It's not just me doing research. It's you Ian it's Ben. Who's producing this podcast, doing research. All of us are makeup, a buying team and. We need to, as sales and marketing professionals, be able to put all of that anonymous data together to shine a light on that dark funnel. So that's huge. The other thing that's huge as sellers and marketers, and this is part of the story [00:09:00] with no forms, no spam, no cold calls is.

Yes. I want to deliver an amazing experience. I talked about geeking out on that and feeling like it's a personal superpower, but yeah. I also want to go to sales club and make money. And I also have a CFO, you know, I don't have unlimited budget to go and build pipeline. And so yes, you pick up all of this signal and you understand.

Who's in market and doing research for your solution, but then you also have to be able to prioritize that. So what accounts are a great fit for you to sell to or early stage, and what accounts are late stage in their buying process? Why is that important? I'm going to use different tactics. And I'm going to spin up different levels of resources and budget, depending on all of those things.

And so what we're able to do is provide these amazing predictive models that show me who's in market for my solution, who the, who my ICP, my ideal customers to reach out to [00:10:00] are when to reach out to them. And what the right message or tactic is. And that kind of brings me to my last challenge, which is marketing is very diverse, right?

It's not, I talked about email and all my emails. That's not the way to reach me. It's just not going to work for you. Right. But maybe it's a social touch. Maybe it's a direct mail, you know, maybe it's. Advertising or content, there's all these different ways to reach people. And so how do you as a marketer orchestrate that across all of these different channels and do it in a way that is personalized and scaled.

So all of that we do for customers in success. So they uncover their dark funnel. They can prior to that as a researcher and focused on the best accounts accounts that are ready to buy. And then it's this orchestration of tactics across both sales and marketing, to make sure that you're being effective in researching prospects.

Ian Faison: [00:10:50] And what does your organization look like? How do you structure your marketing team and Instructure your demand gen team?

Latane Conant: [00:10:56] It's interesting. So when I started at 6 [00:11:00] cents two years ago, it was me and one other amazing lady who now runs customer marketing for us. And it was just the two of us. And we built this and I brought a lot of folks over from Appirio, which is a company I worked at before. But essentially I'm somewhat having to redesign marketing roles based on this new approach.

And I see a couple of things happening first and foremost. Um, I have an awesome partner in sales with Mark Ebert, our head of sales. And we decided early on not to have sales ops and marketing ops, but to have revenue ops. And so we put revenue ops together under one gentleman and he owns the data and the insights and that kind of experienced cycle that I talked about.

He owns making sure that. My team and the sales team have access to all the dark funnel data, the prioritization, the measurement, so that we can all be on the same sheet of music and be successful that I think is really [00:12:00] important for modern sales and marketing teams. Second is a lot of times digital marketing is kind of a weird.

It's either in somewhat in demand gen or it's kind of off on his own, typically in demand gen what we have done is we've put digital marketing under brand and create a digital experience. Because again, if I know that more and more of my cycle is going to be digital. I need to be looking after the full end to end journey and providing an amazing experience.

And to me, brand trumps demand to some degree. Um, so we put those things together and look across that experience to make sure it's personalized. And were you using the latest and greatest technology? Things like chat things like content hubs, things like calculators, so people can understand. Where they are in relation to their peers.

Um, and we follow this methodology that a guy named Brent [00:13:00] Adamson created about buying jobs and helping people complete their buying jobs. So that's a big aspect of what we do. And then, and then we have kind of like a growth role, this amazing gentlemen who run. He started out running our BDRs, and now he's really looking after kind of overall pipeline for us and partnering a lot with field marketing to say, if we're creating all of this demand and we've uncovered all this demand that was in the dark funnel, it's not really about generating demand anymore.

I know your podcast is called demand gen visionaries. I would challenge the new world order to be thinking about not demand generation, but demand capture. Because if you you've uncovered the dark funnel, then you actually see the demand right in front of you. And it's about, okay, now, how do I go and capture that demand with the best experiences, the coolest field events, the best content, direct mail packages, cadences, personalized [00:14:00] outreach, things like that.

And then of course I have product and customer marketing as well. So that's kind of how I think about the team.

Ian Faison: [00:14:07] Yeah. I mean, that's fascinating. I'm so curious to see, you know, how the next months and years develop on this. It does seem like you are truly rethinking the strategy of how to align your team to go get those accounts. You know, obviously you're selling to marketers. Predominantly, what does your persona look like?

Who are the types of people who buy 6 cents?

Latane Conant: [00:14:29] We truly do sell to a buying team and our functionality that, you know, our platform services three, really four main personas. So the typical demand gen visionary, like that would come on this show ahead of like SDRs or BDRs is a critical persona. And then obviously digital demand gen because we've got amazing kind of advertising capabilities, programmatic advertising display, as well as like paid social with LinkedIn [00:15:00] and then really, really importantly sales.

So most of our programs have 50% of kind of the use cases or sales use cases. Because if you think about. The formula that I'm talking about. It's so simple for sales to know when to engage, right? So for sales to know when an account is in market, so they can do their outreach for sales to know just because you're starting to meet with the client and maybe you think you're winning a deal.

The reality is it's an iceberg, right? So there's what they're telling you. And the meetings that you're having. And then there's all these things that are happening underneath that iceberg. And we want to provide that to sellers so they understand what competitors are in this deal. What website pages are they.

Visiting, what keywords are they researching that could drastically change my pitch, my deal strategy. And so we want be yeah. Able to provide those right in front of us sellers so they can do the best job and show up in a way that they [00:16:00] can be proud of.

Ian Faison: [00:16:01] Well, let's get into some of those. Our next segment is the playbook. So this is where you get to open up the playbook a little bit and talk about some of those tactics, some of those strategies, some of those best practices. On the way that you capture that, that demand. So if you had three channels or tactics that are your uncredible budget items, what are those three?

Latane Conant: [00:16:26] Yeah, I like that. So the first thing I would say is something called the value card, and this is a term we kind of made up. We created, but when I talk about the, you know, no forms, no spam, no cold calls, formula. It's not that we're not sending emails ever. And it's not that we're not calling. I'm not banning people from using a phone.

I'm not taking their cell phones. But what it is saying is. Are emails then calls are all geared toward to add value based on [00:17:00] a ton of insights and based on accounts that we know are in market. And so how does that inform our playbook? Well, something that we do is this value card. So basically what happens is when an account is in market, a BDR gets notified that the account is in market, and then they can see the top keywords that the account is researching.

And so then what marketing does is we take all of the top keywords on a quarterly basis and we outline what that keyword means for each of our key personas. So it's best if I walk you through an example. So let's say this quarter, we love, can we see, Oh my gosh. In our ideal customer profile, predictive analytics is right now, one of our top keywords.

We need to create a value card. So we create a value card. The value card is for predictive analytics. If you were the head of sales, researching predictive analytics, that means in that you are interested in probably things like forecasting, accuracy, deal acceleration. If you are the [00:18:00] head of demand, gen researching predictive analytics, you probably care about lead scoring or lead quality.

So we essentially map this keyword to each persona so that when I'm a BDR and I see that you're in market and I see the research you're doing, and I see it's predictive analytics, and I see that your demand gen, I'm going to have a different conversation and I'm going to marry up different content than if you're in sales.

So these value cards are key to ensuring that right from the start of our outreach, we are adding value to the brewer. So nowhere outreaching to, so that is. A huge part of our playbook. The second part of our playbook is something called a six Q a. So I don't track MQL. I don't care. Never have, so we'd have no MQL and don't worry about them.

What we're looking for is to understand the sweet spot in a buying journey when. Enough people on the buying team are engaged, [00:19:00] meaning they're consuming content and the account has gone from. Learning too, we think open to engagement. So how do we determine that on a look again at the dark funnel data?

So we want to look at anonymous data and known data, and we want to know, I look at four kind of key scores we want to look at is this even a good fit account for us? Is this in our ICP? So we have a model that is constantly updating, looking for accounts that meet our ICP criteria. And look like other accounts that we have one.

So it's always updating and changing in real time. That's first, second is a model that looks at who is typically on a buying team for closed deals for us. And how is that buying team? Are these the right personas? Engaged third is the level of engagement and the types of activity they're doing. Are they on our pricing page or are they on a competitor website?

And then fourth [00:20:00] is, it's kind of this timing model tells us where they are in their journey and that all that comes together to give something a score called a six QA, which is a six sense qualified account. And that triggers a lot of our outreach and process. The value card in the six QA are super, super critical to our place.

And then the, the third that's critical to our playbook is how we connect up channels. Be it, our chat bot, be it, our, our content hub to a dynamics segment. That's always changing to make sure that our experiences across the board. So wherever you go, we can kind of follow you and you as an account and make sure we're delivering.

A personalized experience. I would say those are the three big components of our playbook.

Ian Faison: [00:20:50] And then, so when it comes to the types of money that you're spending to, you know, to capture that demand, you know, creating [00:21:00] content, doing things like that, what are some of the things that have worked really well in the past year?

Latane Conant: [00:21:05] Yeah. So we're crushing it with direct mail. Crash crash, crash, crash, crash. So that has been really, really great for us. And we use both Alison San DOSO for our direct mail. So we use both of them. We think there are different use cases, so that's been awesome. Another big part of our strategy. And it's interesting because this was part of our strategy pre COVID and I guess sometimes it's better to be lucky than good, but I've always had a video first.

Strategy for content development, because from one video asset, you can see creates so many derivative pieces of content. From a video asset, you can create a podcast. You can create social tiles with quotes, you can create. Wow, you can aggregate them and create IBA. You know, that you can just go lots of places from a video asset.

So we've always really thought about strategy is being [00:22:00] video first. And that has really helped us because, you know, people have a human need to connect and to see the whites of someone's eyes. Right. And so we get just a ton of great engagement on our content. I think with, with that strategy.

Ian Faison: [00:22:16] I mean, yeah. Preaching to the choir on that. Obviously, considering we make podcasts for a living. The thing that we always just got feedback on with video is just that it's so expensive that like, I mean, obviously depending on the type of video, but it can just be so costly to do expensive shoots and then, you know, all that sort of stuff.

So we generally found that like you have podcast is like the. Probably depending on the type of shoot you're looking at, like either five times cheaper or somewhere in that, in that mix. And you still have, can make all the derivative content, all that other stuff. But I totally agree. I mean, I think if you're creating things that are like actually novel and practitioner driven or research driven or things like that, like you really can't beat it.

Like it just. [00:23:00] Especially with so many people that are out there putting out like really low quality, kind of like $10 an article type content.

Latane Conant: [00:23:07] I hate that crap.

Ian Faison: [00:23:08] Oh, it's horrible.

Latane Conant: [00:23:09] Well, the other thing, Ian, about call it a podcast or vodcast is people get writer's block, like interesting people with interesting ideas. Internally and externally, you know, that our great content sources often have writer's block and often their personality doesn't really come through when they go to.

Right. So you can capture actually a lot more our nuance that then again, can turn into a blog, but you wouldn't have even gotten that if you first asked them to write or interviewed and then wrote it because some, some of it gets lost in translation. So anyway, we're, I think we're in agreement on that one.

Ian Faison: [00:23:47] But it's an investment that is, it's not a one off sort of a strategy. And I think that that's kind of to the point that you were. Making is like don't view things as like, okay, well we did this and then we [00:24:00] did it. It's like a journey. It's an evolution of whether it's the content or the activities that you're making, that it can, there's ways to have it continue on in an impactful way.

And there's ways to. I think help people create things rather than just kind of like try to take a, take a talented writer and say, Hey, write me, you know, three articles a week. Like that's just a very difficult proposition and you have to find that person and then retain them, which is really hard.

Latane Conant: [00:24:28] Yeah. Yeah. I'm with ya. I'm with ya.

Ian Faison: [00:24:31] Any other things that you've done or campaigns, maybe favorite campaigns that have worked really well.

Latane Conant: [00:24:37] Favorite campaigns. Gosh, I love them all so much. We had kind of an interesting program that has turned into like my COVID silver lining. So we were in the middle of a road show, a CMO road show where we were going around to all these cities and having breakfast. With CMOs and talking about this new research that we had dropped the [00:25:00] state of predictable revenue growth.

And so March hits and a, the premise of the study sounds insane. Cause nothing is predictable. And B obviously we're not able to travel around to all the cities like we had planned. So we scrambled around and we did, you know, a virtual breakfast, which I was like, this is going to be so lame. And I was so stressed about it and we pivoted and we kind of did it this virtual breakfast.

And we said, you know what, we're not going to talk about predictable revenue growth. That's insane. We're just going to talk about what the hell is happening and what we're going to do, a CMOs, like, you know, everything's changing. And so we had this discussion and we ran out of time. Right. And so then it was like, well, let's get together again next week.

And we just kept iterating on. Very very relevant topics that are here. And now that CMOs cared about and they would, we would send out a survey. They would tell us the topics they wanted to talk about. We tried to find an expert if we couldn't, it was okay because [00:26:00] I had all these brilliant CMOs on, on the call that would talk about what they were doing.

And we just honestly have kept it going and going and going. And now it's, I mean, we've probably done almost 40 of them cause we do it two times every Friday. It's been going on since March, we have about 500 CMOs that participate and it's been so awesome. So awesome. So I don't know that's a campaign really, but it's definitely a silver lining that came out of a campaign.

That's been really valuable to me.

Ian Faison: [00:26:31] So, can I tell you that I had someone reach out to me two days ago and say, Ian, loving demand, gen visionaries, you should have Latney on the show. She's been doing this thing in the mornings and it's like really incredible.

Latane Conant: [00:26:45] Oh, well, that's good. It, it is a fair amount of work to orchestrate. I mean, I hope it doesn't feel that way for, for, you know, the participants, but Matt Heinz with Heinz marketing group. Helps because it is like, we've got it. You know, we want to make sure that [00:27:00] everyone gets a chance to talk that wants to talk and keep it engaging and keep the group the right size so that it doesn't get, you know, and then get an interesting person on to share perspective on whatever the topic is.

And, and then we actually put all the content in a content hub. So what's the coolest part I think is CMOs share. We covered, we covered customer advisory boards last week.

Ian Faison: [00:27:25] I haven't checked it out. I got sent the link for it. I'm going to check it out. I am obsessed with customer advisory boards. I just think it's endlessly fascinating. For some reason, I've gotten to check it

Latane Conant: [00:27:35] Yeah, but one of the ladies said, here's the charter I created. And so we have a sample charter, you know, cause like I don't like theory. I like I learned from examples. Like I want to see what you did and your agenda and then that'll be my starting place and we'll go from there. But like starting from scratch is hard, you know? So we try to put, you know, things like that in the hub that people can use along the way. So it's been [00:28:00] awesome.

Ian Faison: [00:28:00] Yeah, you mentioned it was a lot of work. I mean, how do you budget something like that? How do you, uh, how do you talk to your leadership team and say, Hey, you know, I just feel like this is the right thing to do.

Latane Conant: [00:28:11] You don't, you just kind of do it.

I mean, a girl's gotta have some secrets.

Ian Faison: [00:28:21] That's well, you know, it's funny though, because the one thing that's probably the most valuable asset, uh, what's the most valuable asset that we all have, but specifically of CMOs is your time. Right. But it's the one thing that, that you're probably not getting audited on. So, so you can recalibrate.

Latane Conant: [00:28:38] Exactly. Exactly. I think over time, you know, you earn the right to take risks and trust your instincts. And I will say I was just on women in revenue and doing a lot of mentoring and I love that stuff. Like the biggest thing that I've learned and I'm still learning. But when I look back on like the biggest, like things that I've up, it's [00:29:00] the, it's when I knew it was the right thing to do.

And I didn't do it because someone told me not to, or my gut was saying something and I didn't follow my gut because I wasn't confident enough. And so I, I just always encourage people. Like you gotta really, if your gut is telling you that it's the right thing to do, and it probably is. And sometimes you gotta take those risks.

Ian Faison: [00:29:20] How important is your website?

Latane Conant: [00:29:22] How important is the website? I mean, pretty freaking important. Um, I think that what people don't realize is the front page of your website. Isn't the website is this spider web of tentacles and landing pages. And, but I would say your digital call it, your digital spiderweb is very, very important.

Ian Faison: [00:29:40] I like that. That's a really good point about, because we are super obsessed with them with the front page.

Latane Conant: [00:29:47] Yeah. Like I get all the, you know, I mean, every day you get a comment, what I want this button and I'm like, literally like, no, that's not even how people find it. So, but whatever, you know, [00:30:00] so anyhow,

Ian Faison: [00:30:01] Okay, let's get to our next segment. The dust up. This is where we talk about health attention. And so I'd imagine you have a famous desktop somewhere in your background, whether it's with the board, the sales team, a competitor. Or anyone else? Do you have a famous desktop?

Latane Conant: [00:30:20] I had a huge dust-up with Snoop Dogg.

Ian Faison: [00:30:22] No, no

Latane Conant: [00:30:24] Yes. So Snoop dog was supposed to, so we were known. Add perio for our Dreamforce party. Hey, is the best part.

Ian Faison: [00:30:35] I know I've been to it by the way.

Latane Conant: [00:30:36] Okay. It's amazing. Right.

Ian Faison: [00:30:38] I can, I can attest.

Latane Conant: [00:30:40] best party at Dreamforce, but I had felt like it had kind of gotten, um, I don't know it had gotten too froofy and like, I don't know, I just wanted to make a change.

So we decided we were going to go a completely different direction and have it be really gritty and underground and like reduce the number of people dramatically. [00:31:00] And we booked a mystery guest and we had this whole social campaign to like, guess who the mystery guest was. And it was supposed to be Snoop dog and the day of the party.

I'm in a meeting and I look outside the window and my, all my field marketing team is crying and I'm like, Oh God. And our general council's there. And I'm like, Oh God, Oh God Snoop freaking bailed on us. So stressful. So we had to run around and literally like take out $30,000 in cash to go get  and too short.

Cause I needed gangsters.

Ian Faison: [00:31:42] Oh, no.

Latane Conant: [00:31:43] I had promised like a gangster type gritty party. And so we, we secured new gangsters and had a ranger. Some people loved it. Some people were completely appalled, but we pulled it off, but I'm still kind of pissed [00:32:00] at Snoop Dogg for bailing up.

Ian Faison: [00:32:01] Well, as, as a guy who was born in Oakland, I fully support. I would rather see two short and, uh, and 40 any day of the week over Snoop. And I've seen all of them. So. Uh, I'm I'm for it. You know, sometimes, uh, you know, life, life gives you, uh, lemons, but I would have gone the other way. I'm I'm with it. That's hilarious.

That is a pretty famous desktop. I think you're going to win this for a long, the win this category. It's not a competition, but I think you're winning the dustup category

Latane Conant: [00:32:31] Nice. Nice.

Ian Faison: [00:32:33] any way that you approach relationships, chips with sales seems like you're pretty tied in on, on those things. Any, uh, relationship advice, uh, with sales.

Latane Conant: [00:32:41] So one of the things I talk about in the book is just being a recovering salesperson. And we were taught a process called looking for red flags. And what looking for red flags is, is finding like all of the things that could go wrong in a deal and bringing them [00:33:00] forward. And that was a good thing.

Because that meant that you were like finding issues and able to cover off on them so that your deal didn't go sideways. And so I, we use that mentality when looking at across our entire revenue cycle. And what's helpful is that's a process that I run our revenue ops team helps us with and really works for sales and marketing alignment because it's, Hey, it's no.

You know, no ego, full transparency as a revenue team, let's always be finding our red and always be bringing issues and conversion points forward that aren't performing. Cause that gives us a chance to go and fix them. And so the combination of that, and then I use a planning tool called , which allows me to like hyper prioritize with my team, the initiatives we focus on and, and I, and again, giving.

Sales and you know, everyone at the organization, like true transparency on everything we're working on. There's nothing to hide is [00:34:00] helpful.

Ian Faison: [00:34:00] You know, it's funny. So I, I used to V two mom as well. Um, and I haven't done it for by new company and I don't know why yet. So you've given me a to do.

Latane Conant: [00:34:10] I love you too, mommy. I think I sh I want to be a consultant that does be to own next. So I'm happy to do a workshop with you and your team anytime.

Ian Faison: [00:34:20] We will absolutely take you up on that. That is, that is for sure. Okay. Let's get to our quick hits. These questions, quick questions, quick answers. Just like how quickly you can talk to someone on your website. If you're using qualified.com, we love the people@qualified.com. They're the presenting sponsor of this show.

They're amazing. Your prospects are on your website. Go talk to them. If the CEO of a fortune 500 company walked in your office, would anyone talk to them? They probably would. Well, that's what's happening on your website? qualified.com quick hits land near you're ready. Number one, have you picked up a new [00:35:00] hobby juring shelter in place?

Latane Conant: [00:35:06] Yeah.

Ian Faison: [00:35:07] I was just looking, I was this weekend. I was looking at a bunch of wake surfers and I was like, that's got it. Somebody must have picked that up during certain quarantine and they must be extremely sore. Are you sore? You must be.

Latane Conant: [00:35:23] It's actually not as hard as what, like some of the other water sports for an old lady like me, cause you don't go as fast. Like if you think about it as long and skinny, you're going like 30 miles an hour, two skis, you're going like. I don't know, 25 and with the wakesurf? Yeah, like 10. So it's actually better for us old fogies.

Ian Faison: [00:35:43] Interesting. I like it. That's a great one. How about, you know, I know you've been writing a book for a long time, but have you had time for. Reading, any books or listening to podcasts or anything like that?

Latane Conant: [00:35:56] Oh, my gosh. Yes, I sort of, so I found this [00:36:00] comedian who used to work at Google and now she writes all these hysterical books. Like one, she has one that I just ordered how to be successful without hurting men's feelings. And other nonthreatening leadership strategies for women, Sarah Cooper, she's hysterical.

Ian Faison: [00:36:17] I've seen hers yet. Her stuff is all over.

Latane Conant: [00:36:19] Yeah. So she's just really funny. So I've been, that's what I've been reading.

Ian Faison: [00:36:28] Do you have a favorite quote or motivational phrase, or just any quote or motivational phrase? I suppose

Latane Conant: [00:36:37] Anything we're doing is worth overdoing.

Ian Faison: [00:36:39] if you weren't a CMO, what would you be doing?

Latane Conant: [00:36:42] Hanging out with my kids. I wouldn't work. I only want to be a CMO. That's what I want to do. It's the best job ever.

Ian Faison: [00:36:53] What's the title of your next book?

Latane Conant: [00:36:55] This one nearly killed me.

Ian Faison: [00:36:57] Yeah. You got another one in there once he, once he it's like getting a [00:37:00] tattoo, once you get one, then you have to get multiple

Latane Conant: [00:37:03] I don't know. Maybe the CMO files or something like that.

Ian Faison: [00:37:06] sounds like a great podcast.

Latane Conant: [00:37:08] Yeah. We'll see.

Ian Faison: [00:37:10] Bye honey. That's it. That's all we have for today. Any, uh, any final thoughts? Any, uh, any other stuff? Obviously everyone needs to check out no forms, no spam, no cold calls. Go buy it. It's on Amazon. Just get it for your team by the whole team one, you know, you got a 200 person marketing or just buy 200.

It goes to charity.

Latane Conant: [00:37:27] Totally, totally. No, this is awesome. Thank you. Thanks for having me on.

Ian Faison: [00:37:33] It's been great chatting with you. Yes. So if there's any other stuff for, for Latin, you can check her out on Twitter, on LinkedIn and all that stuff. We'll link it up in the show notes. You are a demand gen visionaries and a, and a wonderful storyteller. Thanks for joining. Well, we got to have you back in the, in the coming months.

Latane Conant: [00:37:49] All right. Talk Sunni and.

Ian Faison: [00:37:51] care.