Creating the Ultimate Unified Digital Experience for Customers
Jacqueline Woods, CMO at Teradata, shares with us her insights around utilizing data to create unified, frictionless customer experiences.
[MUSIC]
Welcome to Pipeline Visionaries.
I'm Ian Faizan, CEO of Caspian Studios.
Today, I'm joined by a very special guest, Jaclyn, how are you?
>> I'm great, Ian. How are you?
>> I'm doing wonderful, excited to chat about
tear data and your background and marketing, pipeline generation, AI, all that
stuff.
>> Good stuff.
>> I know. What a better day to talk about it and with what better person.
Today's show is always brought to you by our friends at Qualified.
Go to Qualified.com to learn more.
Qualified is the number one conversational sales and marketing platform for
every company's revenues team that you sales force.
So head over to Qualified.com to check them out.
First question, what was your first job in marketing?
>> So I think my first official job in marketing was probably
when I was selling horoscop cookies.
>> Yeah.
[LAUGH]
>> And really thinking about how to sell that or anything else as a kid.
And I was just always really good at raising money and
fundraising which kind of in many ways led me to have an interest in
what motivates people to buy things.
And it's more than just quote, talking good about something.
It's actually kind of having a true belief in what you're selling and
having value around that and what the messages are.
So I honestly would say that because I think that prepared me for
many things, interestingly enough.
>> In Flash forward to today, what does it mean to be CMO of tear data?
>> Flash forward or fast forward, which feels literally like a flash.
>> [LAUGH]
>> Because it started my career and it's been well over 25 years.
So it's been quite the journey.
I actually started in financing accounting and not in marketing,
just because I like data and I like information around data.
So that kind of prepared me to be in a role like tear data.
Because it is a company that is focused on data analytics and
insights on a cloud based platform.
And so in this role and particularly what it means for
me is I really get to think about how people use data and
insights to really improve their businesses.
And so that to me is pretty exciting.
>> It is interesting how being data driven has changed so
much over the past decade and what you can do with that.
And obviously we're gonna get deep into data here in a little bit.
But it truly is to be a data driven marketers is a pretty exciting opportunity.
>> Yeah, yeah, it really is and
I think this is an interesting time, right?
Because we're at an inflection point.
And the way people think about brand and
the way people think about how things get sold has changed dramatically.
And the landscape for how that gets done has changed dramatically.
And all of that basically means that you need more and
more data to make better decisions.
And you need to understand how to use that data.
So I do think that that's something that one interests me and
still excites me even now after all these years.
>> Let's head to our first segment, the trust tree.
Where we go and feel honest and trusted and
you can share this deepest darkest pipeline secrets.
Tell us a little bit more about Teradata, the company and who you're selling to
>> So we sell to what I would call the global 10,000.
So when you think about larger companies, big banks,
big transportation companies, big retailers,
big healthcare companies.
Think about those types of companies first and
foremost as our primary and core customers.
And what we're selling is really,
I like to think of it as three, what I would call core goals that most
companies have.
The first and foremost is how do I improve my overall business performance?
And so there'll be a lot of modeling both on the,
what I would call, FNA.
So finance and analysis landscape.
The second one would be, what do people think about when they think about
customers 360?
How do they deepen engagement with customers?
What does that really mean?
How do they create more stickiness?
So lots of interest in that from many, many customers and
many, many points of view and the third leg in that stool is generally on
innovation.
So how do you use insights to drive innovation around products and services?
And how do you use that information to inform what you do with your products
and
your capabilities around your products?
>> And then you mentioned sort of a little bit about that persona.
What does that buying committee look like for those types of accounts and
those different personas?
>> It's changed, right?
So when, oh, bought technology and when I say back in the day,
back in the day probably wasn't that long ago, back in the day was probably
five to
ten years ago, heavily dominated by the CIO and
the CTO that kind of they made the decisions.
People who were in a function or in LOB did not have as much say,
in the products and services that were being purchased.
And oftentimes those products and services may not have been meeting their
needs and
they may not have been expedient with how they got deployed throughout the
organization.
Cloud changed all that, right?
Cloud really has been a democratization of services and products.
So when you think about SAS and SAS providers,
they're really giving and serving products and
solutions on a scale that we probably couldn't even imagine 10 to 15 years ago.
But you don't need to necessarily, you always need to kind of go through your C
IO.
But you don't, these are things that a line of business owner can essentially
procure on their own because most of these things are as a service.
So you can have a line of business owner, a divisional head,
someone who's the head of a function, and they can go and buy marketing
technology.
Or they can go and buy technology that they think is going to serve them and
what they have to do for their own corporations or functions.
As long as they manage their own bottom lines because most of these guys have P
and
L's.
And so that has changed the game completely because now when you sell,
you're not just selling to the CIO.
It's usually the CIO plus a line of business owner or CIO plus a data scientist
or
CIO plus a functional business head.
And there's probably two to three people that I would say kind of are at the
core
of making that decision, whether you have a chief procurement officer or CFO,
CFO, CIO in line of business person or the data person that I mentioned earlier
So that's how it's changed.
And what I would share is that the decider,
like who ultimately decides is generally the LLB leader in many cases.
Because it has to work for them and how they drive outcomes for their business.
So they are very invested in these decisions and conversations.
So the partnerships have changed in organizations.
>> Yeah, I forget the step, but it's like someone just came out with,
that it's like the average buying community,
people now are so great at that, right?
It's like, I mean, it's as you mentioned because there's so
much reliance on the line of business folks to really fight for
those dollars that it's not something where one person is just going to sort of
like wave the magic wand that's going to get done.
>> It's not one person but who you definitely need to make sure you have
a great relationship is the person with the budget.
>> Right.
>> So I would always, I like to say, well, many people think they have a vote
in
the vote, but when it comes down to it, I do think like in the organization,
it's important for stakeholders to be involved in these decisions.
And whether, I mean, I manage a function, right?
I am a functional leader.
And it doesn't mean that I just go buy whatever I want.
I manage those discussions across who I think my stakeholders are.
Ultimately, I am making that decision.
Ultimately, it is the money coming from my budget.
And so that is a case in many cases, but I would be remiss to say that I'm not,
not making sure that I have those conversations with my key stakeholders on
technologies that we may be purchasing that will have an impact to them and
what they do in the company as well.
That's just smart business.
And I think it's important that people do that.
So while it may not be 15, the ciders, right?
It comes down to kind of two or three people who really ultimately own that
decision because you're the P and L leader, there certainly are many voices in
the room that you have to make sure that you try to get aligned to drive that
decision forward.
And what's your marketing strategy?
How does demand and pipeline generation feel like that?
We do a few things.
First and foremost is I think having a strong account based marketing process
and strategy is critically important.
And it's interesting because it is a philosophy.
I feel very fortunate actually because my CEO believes in ABM.
Not all companies believe in it.
If you use account based marketing as one example of an opportunity to
drive demand across your portfolio, it is not for the faint of heart because
it takes time to garner these relationships across a broader set of
constituents.
Like you just said, there may be 15 people who are giving input to a certain
kind of opportunity that's out there.
And if you have built the right relationships across the organization,
then it certainly makes it much easier and you have a lot less friction as you
're trying to navigate and scale an organization.
So my assumption is that is many voices that are in the room as possible that
you
believe that you can influence your account based strategy is going to inform
that.
That is one of the things that we are very bullish on.
The second thing would be leveraging our digital presence and even our own
dot com environment.
Teradata dot com, I always say, is the number one employee in the company.
It's on 24 hours a day, 365 days a year.
And the thing that I say about Teradata dot com, it speaks for you when you
cannot
speak for yourself.
So if you have a strong website, strong environment, strong, what I would call
integrated kind of chatbot strategy, it helps to understand and inform what
people are looking for, what they're asking for and helping to understand,
are they finding what they're looking for and are they staying on your site
longer
than the average?
We recently did a whole cell kind of upgrading transformation to Teradata dot
com.
And we've increased engagement by more than 100%.
I mean, people are staying on the site three times as long as they were before.
We did it based on roles so you can kind of find information whether you are
kind of
strong IT vet, strong business vet, strong data and analytics.
We kind of positioned our content to help serve you based on the kind of person
that
you are.
And I think that's worked tremendously well.
So those are just kind of two things that I would say that we doubled down on.
Yeah, it seems like, especially if you're going after the global 10,000 and you
have
to just be so targeted with understanding all the different people in the room
at those
type organizations because, you know, there's not, they are very specific and
they are very
different and they act very different and their level of seniority and all that
sort
of stuff.
Yeah, there's not this, what I would call one size fits all.
There is a very, I would say one size actually doesn't fit all particularly and
having those
dimensions that you can personalize on or do more personalization has become so
much
more important than it was even two or three years ago.
I think what happens when you look at how people purchase particularly coming
off of
COVID, everyone now has a certain level of expectation around what a digital
experience
looks like and how they expect to engage with you.
And that has changed tremendously.
And we have an expectation that you somewhat know who we are, maybe not 100%
know us like,
you know, I just met you and now I know everything about you down to your DNA.
But there is an expectation that you have a general sentiment and consensus
about what
I like, what I need to understand, how I learn, how I actually kind of absorb
and ingest information
based on my own behaviors.
And when we do understand that better, then we can target you in a way that
doesn't feel
intrutent but feels complimentary to your particular strategy.
I will give you an example.
So I was reviewing some, today I was reviewing some ads and one of my, she's
actually the
leader of in our APJ region.
And she literally said in her note, I know this ad looks very text heavy
because obviously
it was in Japanese characters and it did look very dense.
And she said, however, in the Japanese market, it is very much about like
learning and kind
of taking someone on a learning journey.
So this dense text is what, you know, she gave a number of other examples of
kind of
what others were doing.
This dense text at the banner level is what people are accustomed to.
Now that may be very different from what people see on a banner ad obviously in
the state
because quite frankly, they don't like a lot of dense data in a banner and they
're just
looking for pippier comments and something that's kind of hit you and kind of
grabs your
interest and then you want to drill down.
But you need to be more attention grabbing whereas the banner ad in another
geography
is going to be a little bit different.
So you do have to employ these different types of what I would call meat
strategies, kind
of a cross your entire ecosystem.
And there isn't a one size fits all.
I love that.
Yeah, we think about that stuff all the time obviously because we're marketing
so many
different types of content with all of our customers and just how little those
little
differences are in how a developer versus someone who's in finance versus a CFO
versus
someone in IT or those little things make such a massive difference.
And not just that the copy matters but it's the broader thing, the broader
lesson there
is like if even just the little ad copy matters, imagine how much all the other
stuff matters,
imagine how they consume a webinar, imagine how they go to an event, imagine
how they
want to be told to or marketed to.
It's like it's kind of never ending.
Any other additional thoughts on strategy or your organization structure or how
you think
about marketing?
So one other comment that I would make on personalization because in some ways
there's
such an expectation for it to be better than what it is.
And I think we've all had the experience of you may have called into a call
center or
you may have gone and entered some information into a form and it's across a
certain, like
you're on the company's website and you're thinking, I've entered this
information to
the form.
It should be a resident there.
You should know who I am.
So I don't want to enter it three more times just because I'm downloading
another piece
of content in the same session that I'm in.
And so I think that for me when I think about better engagement and highly
personalized
experiences, it's do you really know who I am?
How do I somewhat reduce the friction?
People have in many ways moved away from gated content, but sometimes you want
the content
gated because you do want to give people more of what they're looking for or be
able
to say, hey, what about this or have you thought about that?
Because sometimes you don't exactly know everything that you are searching for.
Sometimes you need to be prompted.
And so I do think as we kind of move into what I would call personalization, 2.
0, 3.0, 4.0,
or this next realm of personalization, it's going to be really incumbent upon
all of us
to really think about how do we provide more frictionless experiences and
across our digital
domains, whether that's support or customer success or developer portals or
other places
because you know that your prospects as well as your customers are entering in
these different
places, can you provide what I would argue would be a consistent and unified
digital
journey and experience?
And most of us are not there yet.
We just know what it should look like and ultimately I think if we get there,
it's going to be
so much better for both prospects and customers and just give someone such a
much more immersive
experience, which is what I do know that everyone is looking for.
Do you get that experience where you feel like, gosh, I really enjoyed what I
just read.
That was interesting and thanks for serving up that additional content because
that was
something else that I wanted to know that I didn't know before.
So those are ways I think to deepen engagement with your customers as well as
to just create
more stickiness for your brand overall.
Yeah, it's just doing the work for them, right?
And like, I was thinking about this last night, I had logged into, I set up an
old TV and I
logged into an old profile for on Amazon and I was like, it was a bunch of
shows, it was
like, you would like this.
I was like, I've already watched that.
And I was like, you would like this.
I was like, watch that one too.
I'm like, I'm gonna be logged in the wrong thing.
And then I was like, what episode was I on this thing?
And like, that's the sort of stuff when it comes to like content and how
companies could
like do way better, obviously, like that's the sort of stuff where, oh, you
actually
you've already read a blog post for like, this was the one that you just
finished and
this is where you left off or like you were listening to our podcast and this
is where
you left off, like those sort of things that really help you in like the
research page
and the discovery phase like, hey, you've been here four times and like, stuff
that you
were looking at like, I do want to know that stuff and it is a wheel and it is
tiny bit
creepy, but it's like, we really want to know that stuff.
But I'm like researching a company, I'm like going to buy a product.
Like, I would like to know, have I been here before?
Like, how many years ago?
Like, oh, you looked at this company three years ago, you haven't been back
since like,
a lot has changed, you know, whatever.
Right.
And we do want to know, so even though people sometimes say, oh, they don't
want to know
and I don't want you following me around and all this, you know, and there's
perhaps
some truth to that, but my attitude is if you go talk to a sales associate and
if you
are, you know, just happen to be looking for some outfit, something kind of
very generic,
right?
And you're a sales associate, you're going to ask a certain number of questions
in order
to serve that customer the best that you could.
That's what happens when you go into a store.
They start asking questions, what are you looking for?
Is it a special occasion?
One and on and on, you know, they start asking you, but good ones start talking
to you about,
you know, things that are as mundane as like even your family life because
essentially,
they're not necessarily sizing you up to say, what can I sell you?
They're sizing you up to say, what is the best thing that I can offer you so
that you
would actually convert to buying something?
They're asking you those questions on purpose and somehow in the span of
someone doing that
in person, it doesn't seem as intrusive as when that may be done digitally.
And I think that just for a staking time and for some of the other reasons, if
you don't,
you know, you're not going to do everything face to face, that having a digital
assistant
would help you to do some of those things certainly much more effectively.
And I'll just give you another example of that.
We are doing a recommendation engine for retail.
And in the example, I said that it would be important.
So this is what for some outerwear for, you know, someone who's like going to
go mountain
climbing or something like this.
And I said as part of the kind of narrative for this that the recommendation
engine in
terms of looking at modeling in a large language model that they would actually
know based
on the data that was sitting in the database that they would know that the
person was allergic
to wool.
Now, if you just Google what is the, you know, kind of materials that keep you
warm, they
are kind of, you know, wool and other animal based products and not everyone
can wear wool.
And I said as part of the, you know, kind of recommendation engine, what this
would be
ingesting and what it would already know, it would say like, I understand that
this is
an allergy that you have here is the alternative fabrics that give you the same
kind of warmth,
you know, but don't have the same other properties that are, you know,
discomforting or make
you uncomfortable because someone who's alert to wool, trust me, you're not
going to buy
something wool because it is like you really are uncomfortable.
And so those kinds of things as compared to telling me that someone bought four
jackets
that look like something else is personalization.
When you really understand some specific characteristics, when you really can
put forward a recommendation
where someone says, this company really does know something about me and you
feel like you're
saving time and they are invested in giving you the best outcome that you can
achieve.
So the best opportunity for success, right, without without spending a lot of
time because
if you go to a store that only sells wool jackets, then why go there?
You need, you need other options that, you know, have more texts or something
else.
So those are the things to think about.
I love that I was talking to, this was years ago, I was talking to a senior
product leader
at Stitch Fix and they were saying that basically that their data showed that
if someone answered
and I think it was either eight or ten questions of their survey, that they
would, they basically
would turn way less.
But if they, if they just like skipped it or if they answered less questions,
it was
like if they answered six, they would turn like 20% more or something like that
And it was like actually just to get the information from them was so valuable
because the person
was would get a better experience.
And I always think about that like with clothes, we're like, yeah, if you get
those two extra
measurements, like it will literally fit better.
But for tech, for V2V, we're just like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but just give
me the thing.
Let me try, let me try, let me try.
And it's like, actually, if you could just get a little bit more data on the
front end,
we could probably make this whole thing better for you.
You get a little bit more data on the front end, you can actually see whether
the product
is actually a fit or what do you do, need to do to make the product be a fit.
I mean, you know, anything is what I call elastic and scalable.
So it's not like software is obviously like a pair of jeans or just kind of
fits perfectly
when you put it on or not.
If you have to kind of understand what are those dimensions and capabilities
that are
there that you can use and understanding what those really are or what's most
important.
And that's what allows you to do a better job with your own customers.
I always say in V2V, it's not so much, yes, selling to American Airlines is
important,
but what's better for me to understand is what is the American airline
passenger experience,
what does that need to be?
And knowing that experience and understanding that what are you trying to do
with your
VANx program, what are you trying to do with your loaded program?
And what does it mean when your operations are operating at top capacity?
What does that mean for the airline?
And how does our technology help you do that is what we're really focused on.
And I think those are the things because it's about the customer's customer.
Yes, American Airlines is extraordinarily important, but who do they care about
They care about the consumers that are relying on their flights every day.
Okay, let's get to the playbook.
This is our segment where we opened up the playbook and talked about the
tactics that
help you win.
Back from what are your three channels or tactics that are your uncuttable
budget at?
I don't think I would have said this a year ago and not because we were in CO
VID, but
just because I think how important the face-to-face experience is today even
more than it was
five years ago.
And so I would say you still have to do events, you still have to do in-person
events.
There is no substitute for people feeling like they have a human connection and
a human
interaction with someone.
It's critical.
Now, maybe weird for me to say the next one is digital.
So, the next one is digital because so much of what people do just in terms of
time-saving
because time is so scarce is you have to have a really strong digital strategy
for you to
kind of make any inroads because that's what everyone looks first.
You're not going to be able to get them to an event if you haven't done the
work, I would
say digitally and been able to kind of have those conversations through your
digital channels.
And the third and really equally important to all of them is this notion of how
do you
build trust and thought leadership around your brand until it is building
awareness
and having a strategy on thought leadership that really exemplifies why your
brand should
be the brand that people come to, I think, in a world where trust has eroded
significantly.
That building trust and understanding that you need to have a position and a
thought leadership
point of view on that is incredibly important, particularly at this time.
How do you do that and how do you get those stories out there and get that
information
out there?
Well, one of the things that we do is, I mean, one week we test and do a lot of
research
and we are one of the most trusted companies we've been for the last 20 years
listed as
one of the most ethical companies.
People talk about responsible AI.
I tell people that AI is not responsible.
It is a technology.
Yeah.
AI needs to be trusted.
People need to be responsible and that it is incredibly important for people to
be responsible.
When people are responsible, I do believe that they build trust.
They create an environment of trust and that this is going to be so important
over this
kind of next horizon.
We are at an inflection point with AI and generative AI and the only way that
this is
going to serve us for the betterment of all mankind is really to be able to be
trusted.
The way that I see it is, and obviously AI being a term that is literal, so
enormous to
even talk about or to think about, but specifically as it relates to B2B
marketing and how we are
using it in B2B marketing is if you say, what are the four best ways to write a
blog post
and you put that into a chat sheet of what ever spits out this thing, perhaps
that gets
the blog post done for you or whatever, but if you want to know Jacqueline's
four best
ways to create a blog post, that to me is way more interesting because that is
actually
something that she has been doing.
I know that it is bias because it is from her.
I trust the bias.
I know that she does things her way.
It is not the right way or the wrong way, it is her way.
I can pattern match my stuff off of that.
Whereas if you are doing the same thing with content creation where it is like
you have
this other thing where it is just predicting what words should go next, again
it might
be maybe even a more correct answer or maybe something that is whatever, but I
think that
is where you go back to the idea of responsible, who is responsible for hitting
publish on
this thing because if our goal is to help our prospects and customers do their
jobs
better, then someone has to be to stand behind the stuff that you are putting
out and be
like, hey, I rubber stamped this that I think that this is good enough to go
out and if
it is not, you should not put it out.
If you can't, if you can't, then you should not put it out either way.
I think your first statement was how to write a great blog is different from
writing the
blog.
How to write a great blog may give you some pointers on make sure you do not go
over 500
words and make sure that you use plain language and make sure that you have a
strong headline
and make sure that you give specific customer examples.
What I just said are four great ways to kind of bring content to a blog.
If you ask chat, GPD, that question, you are likely to get that type of answer
as compared
to asking it to write the blog for you on what are the best ways and kind of
compose
it very different composing something or giving you some ideas on making sure
you don't forget
like important topics that should be considered for your specific blog or
category, which
is where I think chat GPD can be valuable versus chat GPD being the author of
something.
Like you said, if I did the research and that popped up and I would say, "Oh,
here's great,
you're right.
These are the four things I need to catch a headline.
Is this headline catchy?"
"Oh, I need to have a customer example.
Here's my customer example."
It may be able to help you do those things in a way that you're saying, "I don
't have
to think about what are the four elements that make it best.
I just want to have the four elements and as long as I'm making sure that, do I
have
these four elements?
Yes, I do.
Now I'm good to go."
To your point, again, going back to the trust, plagiarism is still a real thing
You've got to be responsible for your own intellectual property and that you're
not
taking others, which also known as stealing.
Yeah, no, exactly.
I think that that's sort of like, "Hey, we're borrowing everything."
This is not necessarily the case.
I think the other thing too is like, "Hey, give me 20 headlines for a blog post
that
is XYZ.
Okay, give me two more.
Make those sound like Sean Connery's thing or whatever.
There's stuff that you can do that's so fun and funny and creative and all of
that stuff
that can get to, like you said, working the problem.
But at the end of the day, your company has to put the rubber stamp on it and
put it out
there and say that it's yours.
And if you're saying the seven best ways to run a mile, and it's like, "Did
your company
really believe that this is the seven best ways to run a mile?"
Because if not, you know, it would be a bit of a thing.
It's not be putting that out there.
But that, to your point Ann, that goes back to trust and it goes back to you in
the company
and the people that are in the company.
You are the ones that have to be responsible and accountable and you've got to
be accountable
to your employees.
You've got to be accountable to yourself.
And then last but not least, you have to be accountable to your shareholders.
And I think that it's going to be really important that people step up and own
that
because when they don't, I think it's going to be difficult, right?
Because nobody wants to be the first person that has a big faux pas.
Some attorney already had it where they wrote some kind of brief and got cens
ured, I think,
by some judge because they used information coming out of chat, GPT.
And what happened, it's only as good as the data that's inside of it.
So the data was some bad data that had been put in by someone else, which is
why you have
to be responsible.
Responsible is the word and it's the people that have to be responsible.
And I will say that every day until it's really, really believed.
Yeah.
And it brings up another point here, which is like sometimes the harder thing
is the thing
that you need to do, but also when it comes to specifically content and thought
leadership
and stuff like this, that the easy button is not always the best way to do it.
If it's something that is accelerating ideas to get it out there, to take
action and do
that, that's one thing.
But one of the things that you all did that you recently published are really
cool piece
of content.
And this is something that you all work really hard at for a long time.
Can you tell us a little bit about that?
Yeah, we are just published what is on the conversation around data and
analytics and
being ready and preparing yourself for the AI-driven enterprise.
And we believe that the AI-driven enterprise will be here sooner than you think
, and that
we think it's going to be around 2030.
So it's really only a few short years to get ready.
And what we learned from that study, and I would love for you all to read it,
but what
we learned from that study is really most companies don't believe that they're
currently
prepared, but by 2030, nearly probably over 70% of the respondents said that
they believe
their organizations would be prepared.
So there is a lot of work to do.
The respondents believe that they need to have a connected enterprise.
Most of you listening to this podcast, the first thing you'll say is we've got
data in
many, many places.
We have a lot of data silos.
I think that's one of the great things about Teardatas.
What we do is harmonize and integrate information, do a lot of data modeling so
people can do
quicker business decisions, and from that study, we just kind of learned, one,
not just people's
ambitions, right, hey, this is really important for us to really have an
enterprise that is
more data-driven, but really understanding where they are now and what they
believe that
they need to do in order to meet that ambition of being ready for 2030.
And as you mentioned earlier, Ian, a big theme was on trust in governance and
compliance.
That's a big theme.
Another big theme was innovation, just believing that if they have not so much
just a net information
and it's not about generative AI telling them the next big thing to do, but
really,
how do they really use innovation across the enterprise to figure out maybe
there is someone
in finance that has an idea that could help someone in marketing come up with a
better
way to do something there and really just driving faster, more efficient
productivity
around innovation and capabilities.
So those are a few of the salient points that came out of the study, but really
excited
and would love for everyone to read it.
I'm really excited and I'm going to dig in.
We're going to link it up here on the show notes so everybody can check out
enterprise
2030, but this is like it highlights one of my favorite two of my favorite
thing about
content, which is number one, I love independent research studies because they
're super valuable
because it gives you a snapshot in time.
And then number two, I love things that are forward-looking because we get the
opportunity
to read the tealies and this is how things are.
You have to prepare your business for six years from now.
You have to do that.
Everyone has to do that.
In all of us are sitting there, am I going to be at this company six years from
now?
I don't know, but I need to start preparing the organization for that and I
need to prepare
myself for it.
It's another thing that I always love content that's forward-looking because it
gets a little
bit into the sort of what might happen for sure that the crystal ball reading
and prognostic
getting and it gets those individual people assessing themselves and to say, "
Well, where
do I stand in terms of what this next thing is going to happen?"
Which I don't know what is going to happen.
So then how do I take concrete steps right now in order to see that?
And so I just think that type of content is something that more people should
do.
It's something that people should be investing in and you can do that research
again next
year.
You can do it the year after that.
What do we get right?
What do we get wrong?
Things like that I think compound over time and they give you a well to go back
to over
no.
Now you know you're moving the needle.
I mean, when we started this conversation with Ford, it literally was around
the same
time last year.
And my pitch to them was a following.
There are a lot of people that say data is the new oil, data is gold, data is
this.
And I said, you know, my own belief is that data is more like water because
this planet
is over 72% water.
That is what the earth is comprised of.
The usable water that you can use on this planet is 2.5%.
That is in glaciers, which means that the real usable fresh water is three
tenths of
1%.
And so when you think about data and all the data that's out there in the world
about 90%
of the data is like data that's duplicated or replicated.
And how much of the core data is new data and information that you can use.
And when you distill it down, it probably is very similar to water where the
usable data
that you can use once you've filtered it, cleaned it, harmonized it, associated
it with
the right things is it's probably less than 2% or 3%.
And that takes a lot of work.
And at the end of the day, like our, you know, thematic or our core belief is
that we believe
that people thrive when empowered with the right information.
And I haven't been able to find an example when we came up with that as our
kind of theme
and thesis that that's who we are.
That's what we do.
That's what we live for is that I couldn't actually come up with a thing where
I thought
that people didn't actually thrive.
People don't always necessarily use the right information when they get it.
But if they had it and they were able to use it, that they would actually be
better off.
And it's being able to distill that information down to a place that can be
used.
It's not gold, it is not oil, it is water, it has to be clarified, pristine and
filtered
in order for it to keep you alive and healthy.
And that's what good data does, in good data management does it even more.
So that would be kind of the thing that I really want people to walk away with,
not
just when they read the study, but having that as a core belief in how they
think about
information to be used as a baseline for driving their business forward.
I love it.
Like how Tom Brady drinks like 5,000 glasses a day.
Like once you get it all going, then you can drink a bun.
So I'll go in exactly.
Okay, let's get to the dust up segment where we talk about healthy tension.
Are those with your board of sales teams or competitors or anyone else?
I'm not going to be had a memorable dust up in your career.
Oh, I think we've all had a dust up.
I think we've all disagreed at some point.
And I'll share not something that's so specific, but something that's very
general.
I think that as you know Ian, I think between sales and marketing or just other
functions
in the organization that have similar goals, there's always a healthy bit of
tension on
whether it's how to approach clients or how to tell a story.
Those things are always going to happen.
I tend to be extraordinarily data driven.
So I tend to focus on not necessarily my personal emotion, but like on as the j
inn ziers say,
I have to receive.
So people know I always, I come with receipts.
I come with, they know that's how I roll.
I roll with receipts.
It's kind of like, okay, thanks for your opinion, but I have received because I
just
tend to be very data driven.
And so I think dust ups always occur when kind of it's like opinion versus
opinion versus
more about like kind of what is the information that we have to kind of really
come to the
best decision or outcome.
I've learned over my career to really build allies and build relationships.
I think that's something that you learn as you get older.
These are things that I wish I knew when I was 25 or 30 because at 25 or 30,
you know
stuff and you're like, God, I know this and no one's listening to me.
And you don't necessarily take the time to build the relationships and build
consensus.
Anyone that I mentoring that is like the first thing that I tell them, you know
, please,
please, please think about it's not so much about being right, even if you are
right, but
take the time to build the relationships and consensus.
And then I think you can minimize the distance, but you know, you're not going
to get along
on everything all the time.
And I think healthy tension is good.
I think the conversation should be had.
I think talking about things people shy away from talking about stuff.
I think it's one of the most important things you can do.
Not always going to agree on everything.
Well, you know, it's funny when I took negotiation class, many, many moons ago,
our negotiation
instructor was like the person who is more prepared when the negotiation.
Like virtually.
And it's just like one of those things that stuck with me, the modern allegory,
just
bring this.
Bring this.
Bring this.
Yeah.
Okay, let's get to our final segment.
Quick hit.
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Jaclyn, are you ready?
I am ready, Ian.
Number one, what's a Intellinor skill that's not in your resume?
Well, I used to be at the dance company.
I think my hidden talent is this kind of hidden energy that's inside of me.
I love bringing out that kind of joy.
And even in my meetings that I have with my team, sometimes I start just
playing songs
and getting everyone up to dance.
So my hidden talent is kind of doing that spontaneously.
I don't think people expected.
And then when you're an office service company, they're like, "Oh my God, I can
't believe
this theme.
I was doing this thing."
But I'm thinking something that I love.
And I also just kind of really loved thinking and talking about the future and
bringing people
along.
And I think those two things together are my hidden talents, if you will.
Your favorite book, podcast, do you show that you're checking out that you'd
recommend?
Well, other than your podcast, hey, I'm going to be visionaries.
That's right.
I was just reading this book this summer, which is called Radically Human,
which is really
interesting because it talks about this integration of AI with kind of the
human existence and
know the machines are not going to take over the world of people.
We are again responsible.
So we just need to make sure that we understand that.
But I love that.
I love the notion of using it to be better humans, but not using it to take
over humanity.
Back in the day, everyone was terrified because there was a technology change
and they thought
I was going to take everybody's job.
And the technology was electricity as jobs would play.
So I think we'll be okay.
I think we'll be okay.
I think.
Do you have a favorite non-marketing hobby that maybe indirectly makes you a
better
marketer?
Yes.
My non-marketing hobby is I do a thing with my teams, which they know that I do
I love just walking and I do a walk-and-talk with many of my team members.
I do with everybody.
I do with my whole family.
I'll just start walking and then I'll be like, "Hey, I'm walking.
Let's do a walk-and-talk."
So that's become a big thing.
I think one, just the walking allows me to kind of just decompress.
But I've solved many problems, including the world's problems on my walk-and-t
ops.
Oh, I totally agree.
I'm walking and talking.
In the world and conversations.
Solve it all.
Final question.
What is your best advice for a first-time CMO?
I know you've done this job a couple times.
What's your best advice?
The best advice that I give really all CMOs always is to really understand the
business
that you are marketing.
It is still amazing to me.
I'm always fascinated when I talk to people who may be in marketing, but they
don't understand
the business and how that business actually makes money.
So it's not just I sell a widget, but what does that widget do in the world and
how does
the company selling the widget actually make money?
Maybe it makes money on servicing widgets, but not on producing the widget
itself.
You'd be surprised at the number of people who don't understand their business
models
and the best thing that any marketer can do is you're not the CFO, but please
know how
much the CFO will respect you as a marketer when you are speaking their
language and talking
to them in a business acumen and vernacular that they understand and not
talking sometimes
how we can talk as marketers to understand that is really critical and I
promise you,
I promise you, you will get more budget than you think that you can.
By just being able to help them understand that you understand what the
business model
is and that you're there to help drive and grow that business.
Jacqueline, it has been absolutely wonderful having you on the show.
For listeners, you can go to tarotdata.com, check them out, go check out the
Enterprise
2030 report, we'll link it up in the show notes.
Any final thoughts?
Anything to plug?
Other than the 2030 report, I thought one question you were going to ask me is
what
would I be doing if I wasn't a marketer and you did ask?
I skipped it for time, but I would have to ask it.
I know you skipped it, but I decided that I would be the new Oprah from
marketers because
I think that this is an interesting time for us, that there's a lot of really
cool and
unique things that are happening in marketing that weren't around like five or
ten years
ago, so I feel like this is our time, totally.
Well, I know somebody who runs a company that makes shows, so we'll have to
talk offline.
We'll have to talk offline, for sure.
On my vision board, I think make the next Oprah of marketing would be my pervy.
I'm ready.
Awesome.
Well, it's just so wonderful chatting with you.
Thanks again.
Thanks for being so generous with your time, and we will talk again soon.
Thank you.
Thank you, Ian.
Thanks for having me.
Bye.
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